The Way NBA Players Should Act
by B-Huse on Sep 8, 2010 11:48 PM EDT
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A lot of us (including me) have tried to justify putting Lance Stephenson back on the Pacers squad. What if it isn't true? What if it's exaggerated? Anything we can think of.... but then I read this..... This is what basketball players and every human being should be like. Read this story of Dwight Howard and the wish he made come true for a dying lady.
http://articles.orlandosentinel.com/2010-09-07/sports/os-bianchi-dwight-howard-magic-20100907_1_dwight-howard-bucket-list-cheap-seats
I'm a grown man and I teared up. What an amazing person.... not only fighting off what's wrong but taking it upon himself to make a dying old woman's dream come true. No more justifying Lance Stephenson.... No more saying Brandon Rush's stupidity can be explained. I'm done. We need to realize that we need real human beings on this team..... not necessarily a saint like Dwight Howard..... but a human.
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quit cryin
lmao….. we need guys like roy and george workin all summer, thats what wins championships. I dont care if they are humanitarians (its a bonus) I want guys that work hard and appreciate the opp. they have…… Lance isnt going anywhere so Im glad to hear about him here in Indy Workin.
But didn't he get the cops called on him?
For trying to pick up his own son from daycare…. Damn, I really like this guy!
In my experience...
When a guy gets crossways with a woman, the wildest, craziest ,insanest accusations can be hurled at the guy and the legal system actually encourages it… I just hope that the Pacers get off on the right side of the fence they are stradling with Lance because it’s hard to play basketball with a fence between your legs!
by "right" I mean...
either picking up a good player who will not be a further problem – or getting rid of a problem player who doesn’t deserve to be on the team.
by FortWayneKarl on Sep 9, 2010 12:05 PM EDT up reply actions
Hey if Lance did this he should be punished
I do not know anything about the case, but I do know that I do not want the accusations to be true but this doesn’t mean they are not true. Now, punishment should not be immediately waived.
Meh
everyone is a different person, if you or I or Dwight Howard grew up in Lance’s situation, you never know how we would act. Yeah it sucks, but no one is perfect. The thing is, if we worry too much about character, it can cost us wins, and I do not want to lose games because we are worried about having a team of Dunleavy’s or Murphy’s. Give me the fools and the talent any day of the week and I’m going to create a support system to help them succeed. Now, there are some lost causes, i.e. Shawn Williams, but I am taking a chance 100% of the time and if I get burned so what, f%&k the media.
Your strategy would work great in about 26 other NBA markets
Indiana and Indianapolis expect nothing but the best from athletes that represent our state. We have stewards such as Peyton and Reggie who have set the bar for conduct and public service very high. If players keep committing crimes and representing Indiana poorly then people will stop going to games. If people stop going to games, we will eventually lose our teams.
I’m not saying it is fair to the teams or the players, but it is what it is. If you are an Indiana Pacer, Indianapolis Colt, Indianapolis Indian, or Indianapolis Ice team member, then you represent Indiana and Hoosier values like it or not. Those include hard work, generosity, and compassion, not drugs, alcohol, and violence. We have no collective desire to be the next Hotlanta.
There is a big reason why so many in Indy got behind Butler on their tourney run. Brad Stevens doesn’t recruit players he wouldn’t trust to babysit his children. That kind of character and success will fill seats and bring titles in that order.
wrong...
Indiana is a bunch of bad wagon riders, that’s why we got behind Butler. It had nothing to do with anything else. This wouldnt be an issue if we were winning but we’re not, so we’ll keep looking for things to beech about. If we were primed to win a championship and Lance and Rush were center pieces everybody would have there back. They are not Tyreke Evans so we dnt. Someone said on here that if these guys were 20+ppg studs they’d be worth the headache, maybe he was right. You should look at Hoosier “values”. They are the same as always, what have you done for me lately. If you arent doing anything for us, we are quick to throw you under the bus. Just how it is. This isn’t IU or some college team, these are grown men for the most part,who are paid to win, not be upstanding citizens. Maybe us Hoosiers should get off our high horses, and not be the first ones to cast stones. I know for a fact that noone of us is perfect, and should humble ourselves instead of toting how high OUR values are. Don’t get me wrong I have two young boys that I would like to share the joy of basketball with, and would hope I can teach them that hardwork is the way to get it done. But I’d also like to be able to teach them forgiveness and that we all make mistakes and it’s not always what what we have done, but what we do to repent and correct the situation. Also, none of us should be letting our kids idolize Pro players anyways. We should be alittle less naive ourselves about the situations we find ourselves in and ask if we are really anyone to be judging these young men that have made mistakes.
by Justin Arnold on Sep 9, 2010 5:57 PM EDT up reply actions
one more thing,
just because you don’t get caught doing anything bad, doesnt mean you dnt. And just because you do great things on the field doesnt make you a great person. Case in point Michael Jordan, a womanizing drunk gambler. Peyton, a womanizing arrogant ass.
Reggie, a profane jock grabbing, shit talking ass. Love all three of em and how they present themselves in the public eye, doesnt mean they are good people. Anyone who has met them would prolly tell you that. They just have great marketing, PR guys. Money and talent buys a lot of things, includin a “blind eye”.
by Justin Arnold on Sep 9, 2010 6:05 PM EDT up reply actions
A small counter
I don’t think it’s being on a “high horse” to hope for and expect the players that we root for and help support financially to be law-abiding citizens. I’m not an idiot. I know most of these players don’t have my same moral values, or they aren’t going to do what I’m going to do on a weekend night. I get that, and I’m not asking them to adapt to my belief system. All I ask as a fan is for these guys to stay out of any trouble that might affect the team adversely (prevent the team from growing/winning). And that’s exactly what guys like Artest, S-Jax, Tinsley, etc. have done. Stephenson could very well be on that path.
That’s not judging. I want the Pacers to win and these guys’ actions both on-and-off the court have helped prevent the Pacers from doing so. That’s what people don’t understand about all of the bad behavior. The bad behavior has been just as detrimental to this team’s ability to win than any “choir boys.” or an imbecile coach. That’s why the behavior shouldn’t be condoned, not because we have a “higher moral vision” than these players do. It’s because bad behavior has proven to be a large factor in making this a mediocre franchise on the court. I’ve said it once I’ll say it again: You need both talent and character to win in this league.
I respect your point but,
I would say s- jax has helped bring a charlotte team to a playoff caliber and would say it wasnt the bad behavior necessarily that made us a mediocre team but the reaction to that behavior by management and fans. I think when we start immediately calling for players to be cut or traded for no return value everytime something happens is counter productive to what we are trying to do. There is going to be bumps in the road, and it is up to the leadership to right the ship and move forward. And like I said if we were winning noone would be acting as harshly towards these players. We can’t blame these guys for things others have done in the past. I know it’s hard but we have to let this team move forward without trying to tear them back down at every turn, or we will never be a good team. Matt Barnes of the Lakers just got arrested for suspicion of domestic violence and Ron Artest is a champion now. if it doesnt effect the on the court than let it stay off the court, we are the ones trying to mix the two together. I wish we could have a high all around character (no knuckleheads) team that wins championships, it just don’t happen. Feel free to prove me wrong and tell me which teams fit this category. Also, Im curious how the bad behavior outside the brwl affected our teams championship hopes. Id say they didnt we just got tired of donkeys on our team like tinsley, we didnt like what they chose to do on their time. Some people get caught some dnt it happens, you just got back your team and hope they handle it appropriately.
by Justin Arnold on Sep 9, 2010 10:10 PM EDT up reply actions
“Also, Im curious how the bad behavior outside the brwl affected our teams championship hopes.”
Outside the brawl? You can’t just ignore the brawl. That’s what started everything. The mere fact that almost every important piece on the team had to miss a good portion of the brawl season is one very good example of how bad behavior can prevent a team from winning. The Pacers went from a 61-21 team to 44-38. After that, the Pacers still had the majority of that talented 61-win team, but what do you know? Artest goes haywire, S-Jax and Tinsley start doing their strip club circuit and the Pacers went from 44-38 to 41-41. Then they went from 41-41 to 35-47. See the trend that all started with bad behavior? There were other factors beyond the bad behavior such as J O’Neal’s injuries, etc., but bad behavior was certainly a factor in the regression from an elite team to a mediocre one. Murphy and Dunleavy came and sealed the deal.
One thing you have to keep in mind too is you just can’t blame fan and management reaction for the precipitous fall. A negative, swift, impatient (whatever you want to call it) fan and management reaction wouldn’t have existed without the bad behavior. They’re directly tied. To blame the fan and management reaction is essentially to blame the bad behavior.
“I wish we could have a high all around character (no knuckleheads) team that wins championships, it just don’t happen.”
I actually agree. No team is without any knuckleheads. But when half of your team is knuckleheads who can’t keep their poor decisions out of the public spotlight, then you can see how it gets out of hand (e.g. Indiana Pacers 2004-2007). As long as the majority of your team is a mix of talent/ character (or maybe better than “character” we’ll just say guys who know how to do questionable stuff without getting caught), then the knuckleheads won’t make nearly as much noise.
Did you watch the brawl live? Not just clips from media that made us look like crap, I was literally scared for the Pacers.
The fans were coming on the court to get there homeboys back before Artest ever went in the stands. That fat latin dude deserved to get knocked the f out by JO, dude was trying tobeat up an old man that was an ast. coach or something. We got hosed (artests suspension was unheard of, Xavier mcdaniels punched out a fan and got a handful of games, we were used to make an example and it was totally unfair). The reason I said besides the brawl is because we could debate all night about it and wed both think we were right so I’ll leave that alone with one comment that David Stern screwed us, and other than Artests reaction the rest in my opinion were completely justified, that was a scary riot like situation and the players were defending themselves and each other. Quite frankly, Fuck Detroit and their punk ass fans.
Anyways, JO’s injuries (main factor since he was our only allstar at the time) and Reggies retirement is what made us a mediocre team, not to mention Artest not liking the things being said about him and the fans treatment of him inclined him to ask for a trade. The strip club crap was just salt in our wounds and hell I was mad about the Thug Life shit goin on, but that was because I was mad we got screwed out of a team and a year that we were actually favored to win the title. If we’d have won that year , I like most wouldnt have said a thing about the strip club stuff. It didnt effect the on the court is my point except it caused us to want to trade for less talented players that didnt work out. Which didnt even get fans back in the seats. Its about winning for us plain and simple, we just look for other reasons so we feel better about ourselves and can say “its not about winning or losing its how you play the game”, this isnt peewee football, Its pro ball lets get real, its about winning.
Beyond that half our team is not knuckle heads now. Two players have gotten in some trouble. We need to stand behind the Pacers and have faith they will handle the situation in a manner they deem correct.
by Justin Arnold on Sep 10, 2010 12:01 AM EDT up reply actions
I agree, this is about winning. The difference is I think poor behavior can hurt a team’s ability to win and you don’t. I think if any team is exhibit A as to how no-character talent can run a course of mediocrity it’s your 2004-2007 Indiana Pacers. I guess we’ll just have to agree to disagree.
We can probably both agree, though, that this year’s Pacers team has s different feel than what we’ve had to deal with the past 5-6 years. And unlike Artest, S-Jax, Tinsley, etc., Rush’s and Stephenson’s misdeeds aren’t enough to squelch the optimism surrounding the rest of the team. I can’t wait to see how this team gels, and if Hansbrough or McBob rises to the occasion, I think a 7 or 8 seed isn’t out of the question.
agreed...
I don’t disagree totally about poor behavior, just am fed up with the lack of support from fans for my team, mediocre or not you are right they are my team and I love ’em. Im beyond excited for this year and the future, I hope everything works out good and All my players get a chance to play and show what they can do.
by Justin Arnold on Sep 10, 2010 12:32 AM EDT up reply actions
You can't judege sombody on one act
Nobody is all good or all bad. Dwight is having his legal problems as well, maybe he should concentrate on his own son rather then spending time with fans. I also don’t think either Lance or BRush are all bad. They have imperfections (Drugs, Anger managment), but don’t we all.
Something tells me you don't have ANY problems with women.
by Justin Arnold on Sep 9, 2010 10:16 PM EDT up reply actions
If Vegas would take the bet...
I would bet that Lance didn’t smash this woman’s head into the stairs… What do you think the chances are at 5:30 AM that everyone was the least bit sober? About 0%… That together with a legal system that is rigged and encourages women to “game it” put the Truth in the category of “only God knows”… ALL THAT ASIDE, THE PACERS (PER LARRY) WERE SUPPOSED TO BE COUNSELING THEIR PLAYERS TO STEER CLEAR OF BAD SITUATIONS – I BET THEY DID NOT SIT DOWN AND HAVE A COUNSELING SESSION ABOUT THAT WITH LANCE BEFORE SIGNING HIM TO A GUARANTEED CONTRACT! So from that perspective, management is to blame – meaning Bird specifically for giving a guaranteed contract for no good reason and (again if Vegas would take the bet) NOT COUNSELING LANCE TO STAY OUT OF BAD CIRCUMSTANCES IMMEDIATELY BEFORE OR AFTER SIGNING HIM!!!
by FortWayneKarl on Sep 10, 2010 11:17 AM EDT up reply actions
ooooooooooooo....
I can buy that.
by infinityzero.systemerror on Sep 10, 2010 4:14 PM EDT up reply actions
Definitely a valid point....
I would like to see a rule where new draft picks must stay in Indiana until at least training camp and practice, go through counseling of how to handle themselves and their money, and maybe they head off a lot of potential problems before they happen. They woulld get a chance to see if these young men need help with issues that may cause them problems down the road.
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