My plan for a quick Pacers turnaround in 2010/2011
by aaronb on Jan 28, 2010 12:07 PM EST
Email
Print[From the FanPosts, aaronb sacks up and offers a scenario to shake up the Pacers without waiting for two years. Not a fan of scenario 1 but it would definitely give us plenty of new material write/argue about. -TL]
OK, obviously there are some moving parts to this depending on how the draft lottery works out. If we win the lotto then John Wall becomes the obvious pick and we might need to re-evaluate where we go from there. Let's take a gander at the two scenarios after the jump.
Scenario 1)
We are able to trade Troy Murphy to Cleveland for nothing more than Big z and his expiring contract. We wait out to see where we sit in the Lotto. Likely we are in the 5-10 range, in which case we take the best Power Forward available between Cousins,Favors,Davis or Monroe. Cousins or Monroe in particular will fill the role of rugged rebounding 4 that we really haven't had since Dale Davis was in his prime.
Secondly we offer a contract in the 5/30 range for Raymond Felton to come aboard and fill the PG vacancy that has lingered for far too long.
Thirdly and what will meet with the most resistance is that we package the expiring deals of Dunleavy and Ford to Washington for Gilbert Arenas. Sure his contract is big and there is some risk involved. However with him in tow we will again be a winner. If Indianapolis has shown anything it is that we will support and forgive someone as long as they are contributing to a winner on the floor. I'm quite sure that Gilbert will be willing to keep his nose clean after the gut punch he has taken from the media over this recent affair. He will have 4 yeas left on his deal (Same as Granger) and will provide us with a nice window to compete.
Starting 5 of
Hibbert
Cousins
Granger
Arenas
Felton
With
Hansboro
Rush
Price
Jones
Foster(?)
Filling out the 10 deep. It would be very tough to argue that this wouldn't be a top 4 team in the Eastern Conference. Capable of playing up tempo, or half court.
Sure it carries risk. However as Mike McD said "You can't win what you don't put in the middle".
Scenerio 2)
We win the Lottery and get John Wall. Then we scratch Scenerio 1 and do something else.
44 comments
|
0 recs |
Do you like this story?
Comments
Sorry can’t see this happening. We have no money to sign Raymond Felton this offseason and there is no way the Pacers bring in a guy who brought a gun out on his teammates after what we just went through. I’m not a huge fan of tanking but I really hope things go even worse for the Pacers and the other teams pick it up. Wesley Johnson, Evan Turner, Derrick Favors, and John Wall all seem like “Can’t-miss” players. I’m not sure on the other ones in the lottery. Maybe even use one of our two second round draft picks to help us move up a spot. Or if the Nets get John Wall offer them Dunleavy’s final-year contract and maybe our draft pick if it’s around the ten spot. Walking away from the draft with Devin Harris wouldn’t be too bad.
devin harris...
I liked the idea of trying to trade for him earlier this year, I wouldn’t mind picking him up at all. Don’t know how his injury has been going though.
~SHaFF!~
Lots of problems...
Arenas has stated inthe past he is a point guard
Is this “hey look I can shoot” Felton the real felton (it is his contract year) or is he the felton that can’t hit the broad side of the barn for the first 4 years?
Felton isn’t a very pure pg at all. 5 apg… i am sick of pg’s that can’t pass and can’t set up team mates.
Arenas is an idiot. Always has been an idiot. Not only did he bring a gun in a locker room… he then acted like it was no big deal and made fun of it. Do we really want this idiot leading this team? Oh… this idiot has a huge contract and bum knees.
Dear everybody who is writing up their plans to fix the Pacers,
The team is financially in trouble as is. Any scenario that involves taking on more payroll, especially if they don’t immediately push the team to a Eastern Conference contender, is not a viable one.
This would lower payroll
Murphy would be off the books. Arenas makes less than Dunleavy and Ford combined.
Diener
Watson
Head
Are coming off the books
Foster comes off the books after next season. All total this deal should actually lower the Pacers payroll 4-6 million dollars from what it is today.
" Tell me something Steve, How does a guy from Puerto Rico loose a ball in the Sun? "
Not a fan
of taking on Arenas for more reasons than I care to type about right now. But as far as finances there’s only one way to fix that and that’s to wait…Trading Murph for Big Z will help too, but that will make us an even worse team to watch than we are now…and from what I’ve read most of you don’t want that
I don’t think losing Murphy would hurt us at all. Someone else can get his rebounds. We’d maybe have two-less three pointers a game. Oh, and our defense would be MUCH better. Sounds like a plus to me.
-1
Who’s just going to all of a sudden get murph’s double digit rebounds? I can see Hibbert becoming a much better rebounder, but no one on this team now is just going to start getting double-double’s more often then not, like Murph does.
The only reasons trading murph would be a plus is the extra cap space and for the greater good of Roy Hibbert’s developement. Which, in the situation we are in, is enough to get my vote to trade him, but I’d rather not trade for big Z, but I don’t have a better idea right now.
~SHaFF!~
After next season
We will be sitting pretty as far as cap room…just hope we can get free agents to come to Indy
Arenas....
with his hefty contract, bum knees and stupidity, ….let me think….I ’d have to say no to this one. Scenario 2 seems VERY nice though =)
Opportunity is missed by most people because it comes dressed in overalls and looks like work.
-Thomas Edison
I’m liking Scenario 2 a lot more than Scenario 1.
Trading Murph for Big Z expiring contract gives us what? Cap space. Most likely we would cut Big Z, and the Cavs would re-sign him, and we would have nothing to show for Murph. I’d rather we forget about Z, and acquire a late first rounder or a second rounder and JJ Hickson. Remember the Cavs are under pressure to win now, to keep LeBron, so if they might give up a little more than people think. Draft picks will help us rebuild, expiring contracts – not so much. I also think a JO in his prime was a pretty good 4, and if we could draft a not-injury-prone JO that would do just fine. Trading for Randolph, and (absorbing Maggette’s contract), sounds a lot more appealing to me than acquiring Iggy (and Elton Brand’s contract) from Philly.
Secondly, I don’t think we should dive into free agency since we still suck, and as long as we suck we’re gonna continue to overpay for free agents, and destroy our cap space. Most successful re-building teams have toughed it out, and rebuilt through the draft(Thunder, Griz). Secondly Felton is not a franchise PG. I agree with dbcb about Felton’s improved performance being due to a contract year. Felton just isn’t that good, and certainly isn’t worth overpaying for.
Thirdly, I don’t think anyone will trade for injury-prone Dunleavy or being-paid-not-to-play TJ Ford, without a significant sweetener. As for Gilbert arenas, his contract is the definition of untradeable. We went from injury prone JO and his huge contract, with some trade value(remember the Lakers?), to a being-paid-not-to-play TJ Ford, and his untradeable contract. Let’s not take that a step further by acquiring Gilbert Arenas and his long, massive contract. It will only set our franchise back a few years. The guy’s 28, has knee-problems, and in general is just a clown. In addition, he’s a PG, and won’t accept not starting. He’s gonna send the wrong message to our young guys(especially since we don’t have strong veteran leadership). I think it’s more than just some risk involved. It’s more like a ticking timebomb.
Bring on John Wall!
JO was good in his prime
However JO was never a rugged interior presence. That is what my point was.
" Tell me something Steve, How does a guy from Puerto Rico loose a ball in the Sun? "
What's your definition of rugged interior presence?
He scored in the paint. His rebound numbers were decent. He played solid D, and was a solid shot blocker. In his prime JO was one of the best interior guys of those years.
Almost an enforcer
Ben Wallace
Charles Oakley
Dale Davis
Kevin Willis
A rugged interior defender is a guy who grabs tons of rebounds and offers protection for the other guys on the floor. While JO was a great post offensive force and a good shot-blocker/serviceable rebounder. He was never really a dominant post defender. He also played much better when paired with a “Tough guy” who could do the dirty work that JO wasn’t really wired to do.(Artest,Foster).
Not that JO wasn’t a dynamic plus while he was here. He was just more of an offensive minded post guy. Nothing wrong with that. Just not really what we should be pairing with Roy Hibbert and Danny Granger in our frontcourt IMHO.
We need someone willing to be the “bad guy”.
" Tell me something Steve, How does a guy from Puerto Rico loose a ball in the Sun? "
exactly
DeMarcus Cousins is the best rugged post prospect in this draft by far.
Greg Monroe is probably #2.
If there was a way that we could get both guys. I think our front court could really be set for a long time.
" Tell me something Steve, How does a guy from Puerto Rico loose a ball in the Sun? "
You guys ever think what pairing Derrick Favors with Roy Hibbert would look like? (For those who don’t know, Favors looks like half Dwight Howard and half Amare Stoudemire) Favors is exactly the type of presence Roy needs for our offense and especially defense to flourish. Favors’ offensive game is still raw but there is no doubt he will be an absolute athletic force on the defensive end…. a guy who can help a slower-footed center like Roy.
But has anyone seen the players set to be in the 2011 free agency? Go look it up… I forget where I saw the list but if you can find it post it on here. But it’s not very good. The only few players that seem enticing are players that will be restricted free agents because they are ending their rookie deals and will most likely sign back with their respective teams. I think the best move at this point would be to wait til next year. The final year contracts of Dunleavy, Murphy, Foster, and Ford could be enticing for desperate ball clubs…. but it’s sad…. cause I might go insane if I have to wait another year for this team to rebuild.
oops
Hit post by accident. The eventual cap room we’ll have doesn’t only mean we have X amount of dollars, sign whatever free agents with the money next offseason. You’ve got some major expirings to move for players with talent from teams looking to shed salary for whatever reason.
Or, heaven forbid, we don’t rush out and overpay for someone and just be under the cap. That way teams can REALLY save money trading with us so the incoming money wouldn’t have to match, you can get some real talent that way. Whatever happens, it will not be quick, it’s going to be a long process, too long for some.
no arenas please.
Really don’t need more Pacers players with guns.
I like the idea with Felton.
Cousins will be a good NBA player, but the idea of drafting him cannot be made yet until we know what Hansbrough can really do. After the season we will have to take a look at his season of work including injuries.
I was thinking though… I might write up my own spin off of this now that the thoughts are flowing a little thanks to your post. Until then, here’s one of my first thoughts, what do you guys think about the idea of drafting Downey from South Carolina? I don’t know if you guys watched the South Carolina vs Florida OR Kentucky, but this kid has some serious talent. He’s 2nd in the NCAA in steals, shoots the 3 well, at least a pretty good passer, and he loves the pressure situations. Most of all though, he’s the team leader, he is a polarizing figure for that team, he’s the leader in the huddle, and the team looks to him to make the big plays. Any thoughts? I’ll start working on other ideas so that you guys can completely tear them apart in your replies
~SHaFF!~
I love the idea of rebuilding through the draft. Someone said above about the wonders it’s done for the Thunder and that’s so true. I love watching the Thunder. Great team. I think we should do the same, especially with our history of getting great players with relatively low picks (Granger, Hibby, Hansbrough). I think the draft is gonna be key for us. No big names right now are gonna wanna come here. Let’s face it. The draft is the way to go.
I almost choked on my coffee.
You can’t be seriously counting Hansbrough as a great player. The guy has been a train wreck so far. He missed most of the offseason and the beginning of the regular season with injuries and then when he did play he was shooting something like 35% from the floor. Now he’s been out a month with an ear infection. Nothing about this pick is great, especially considering the guys who’ve played so well that were drafted later than him.
Agreed!
What all the critiques were saying about Psycho T not being able to get his shot off at this level seems to be true. His falure to hit free throws at a good percemtage along with these shin and ear “mystery injuries” make him even a worse choice!
by FortWayneKarl on Jan 29, 2010 8:25 AM EST via mobile up reply actions
c'mon
I’m no big fan of the Hansbrough pick either, but don’t you guys think half a season is a little quick to write him off?
I wanted to believe too, but...
Tyler is shooting just 36% from the field. Only Diener is lower and he’s only played 2 games to Tyler’s 29. His low free throw percentage (74% vs 84% in the NCAA) just points to him being thoroughly rattled and physically exhausted by being overmatched at the NBA level, sorry to say.
by FortWayneKarl on Jan 29, 2010 10:08 AM EST via mobile up reply actions
Not writing him off
But I 100% agree with everyone that you can’t call him a “great player.” And while I agree that the draft is probably the most viable way to make this team better, teams like the Thunder have to suffer through years (plural) of suckitude to get the picks to get the talent. I’m ok with that, but everyone wants a one year or two year turnaround to contender status and I don’t see that happening.
Give Tyler a chance guys…. I get he hasn’t been great so far but some players take 3 seasons to be any good…. it’s been a half of one… and he’s been hurt. I bet there was Danny Granger doubters too when he was a rookie (I’m not saying he’s as good as Danny but I’m just making a point)
Hansbrough
Tyler has better scoring, rebounding, and assist averages than Hibbert had last year during his rookie campaign. While Tyler’s shooting has been inconsistent, he’s made it to the foul line enough to make up for it. It’s way too soon to dismiss him.
by Rick in AVL on Jan 29, 2010 11:32 AM EST up reply actions
This is a joke
Some people on here can get so near-sighted…. Hell remember when Jamaal Tinsley had that HUGE game in his rookie season? Where he had a triple-double and over 20 assists? I’m sure everyone on here was ready to crown him the next Magic Johnson. Now Tyler struggles a little and you’re ready to label him a bust…. he’s played 29 games! Are you serious?! These things take time to find out what the player is gonna become. Just because you wanna look back and said “I told you so” doesn’t justify it. Some of these players will read this stuff. So just don’t be the classic cynical blogger and how about a little optimism hmm?
Have you ever actually watched him play? He has more passion for the game than 95% of the guys playing it today.
Your comments simply make me think you’re only READING box scores and articles about his ear infection.
Come on.
Not to mention the ear thing has been messing up his game, as the guy can’t even keep his own balance. Ya gotta feel for him there.
And yeah his field goal percentage is atrocious, but those are plays where he’s keeping the ball alive when most NBA players would have given up and ran down to the other end of the court. He goes up strong and he’s being blanketed by the other team and yeah, those shots aren’t always gonna go in. He’s scrappy as hell. If you were to increase his minutes, take out that ear infection, none of you would have a bad thing to say about him. Period.
The difference between us and the thunder...
is that while Granger is a really talented player, he is not a once in a generation talent, while Durant is. Durant is a top 10 talent and could be argues top 5 in the league. I do love how they went about it though. Build a young core, get some cap space, and letthem grow together, actually REBUILD! Not jus being stuck in god-knows-what situation we are in now, wit slow, hugley overpaid, white guys. Ahhh it is frustrating.
by captain flitzy on Jan 29, 2010 9:52 AM EST up reply actions
Well I was comparing us to the Thunder in the sense that they built around the draft. Yeah, Durant is a better player than Granger. He was also a number two pick, whereas Granger was a 17. If we were lucky enough to get a number two pick (probably won’t be) then yeah, that’d be great to luck into a player of Durant’s caliber. I don’t think anyone would argue that Danny is better than Durantula.
Better defensively….. but Durant’s incredible offensive game overshadows that argument. It may not look like right now Danny’s that great at D… But I wouldn’t be that great either if my team had no direction or coach. You may sit there and say he should see past that but it’s easier said then done… Also Danny would be much better if he learned how to back people down and not take 7,000 three’s a game.
Comments For This Post Are Closed
Secondary Sidebar
User Tools
FanPosts
Community blog posts and discussion.
Recent FanPosts
In Association With
Ball Don't Lie - NBA - Yahoo! Sport
- Days of NBA Lives: Wherein Roy Hibbert tap-dances to Maine
- Grizzlies Valentine’s Day cards are the key to love
- Kevin Love would like the NBA to take the MLB’s approach on All-Star games
- Kobe Bryant fires a few hilarious salvos at Jeremy Lin
- Brandon Jennings states the obvious regarding his 2014 free agency, everyone goes nuts
Certain photos copyright © 2012 by Associated Press or Getty Images. Any commercial use or distribution without the express written consent of Associated Press and Getty Images is strictly prohibited.
