Roy Hibbert: The Invisible Giant
by goodlucksaturday on Dec 5, 2009 10:22 AM EST
15 comments
[From the FanPosts, goodlucksaturday wonders what is going on with the streaky Roy Hibbert. Just one of several great FanPosts of late. I need to do a better job of promoting these to the front page. -TL]
I'm putting out an APB for Roy Hibbert. His crime is going MIA during games and all in all losing the effectiveness that had him so promising in the first half of this season when the team also looked promising.
Where'd you go, big fella!?
Roy, a double double machine earlier this year, got himself 15 minutes of action last night in a start, but was not hindered by foul trouble. He was hindered by Roy trouble. He put up 0 points on 0-3 shooting and pulled down 1 rebound.
This is becoming a trend of sorts for Hibbert, who despite a serviceable 7/7 game against the Kings on Wednesday, hasn't put together a truly inspiring performance since he last double doubled...three weeks ago.
The team is 5-2 when he scores in double figures, and he was a vital part of the offense for that one stretch of games that have been played really well. When the team was struggling early last night to get into the paint, I think we would've been able to count on Roy to wreak havoc inside while the rest of the guys tried to figure things out and weather the storm that ultimately cost the game.
I'd wonder if it's confidence, but I think Brandon is eating up all the confidence excuses, leaving myself to wonder what happened to the Hungry Hungry Hibbert.
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So true
I don’t thinks it’s confidence. IDK what’s happened. I can tell ya he seems to be VERY slow getting off the floor to finish. He’ll get a nice pass down low (wide open) then get blocked or rush up an ugly lay up in order to not get blocked. He’s worked hard on his body since he’s been here, but maybe he needs to add that excersize where you put a box on the floor and spring yourself over it side to side. He’s gotta stop taking 3 seconds to gather himself to jump. He should be thunder dunking in those situations.
Hibs
I agree Hibbert is struggling and he was particularly dreadful last night. In saying that, he’s also on an incredibly short leash. Last night he was given a measly two opportunities in the post offensively. For a team that’s in desperate need of a post presence and considering Hibbert’s their best option to play that role, that’s unacceptable. Maybe O’Brien’s coaching for his job now and that’s why it’s time to ignore the young guys, but some guys aren’t being allowed to play through mistakes.
Last night after the Pacers got it within 4 I told my brother, this game is over. Threes and quick jumpshots can get you back in a game, but when it gets tight you need a way to get some easy buckets. With no post presence, the Pacers don’t have a way to get easy buckets. Hibbert’s the key to that part of the offense and he’s either largely ignored or pulled after one or two mistakes.
by Hinrich10 on Dec 5, 2009 1:11 PM EST reply actions 2 recs
JOB is the Problem!
Roy’s problem is he has an idiot coach!
by FortWayneKarl on Dec 5, 2009 1:29 PM EST via mobile reply actions
Not sure I understand placing all of the blame in one area
When Roy plays well, puts up a double-double he did a great job despite his coach, but when he plays poorly, can’t score from one foot out, it is JOB’s fault. Pacers problems aren’t so easily explained away and remain a good two years away from being resolved. Personally, don’t see this current roster as a 50+ win team.
Agree
It’s not on Obie. I never liked this guy’s rotations, but I do like how he’ll play the guys that are playing well. Roy is not playing well. That’s not on Obie. If Roy can’t hit his hook, that can’t be blamed on the coach. That’s an issue Roy needs to resolve with Roy.
by goodlucksaturday on Dec 5, 2009 3:20 PM EST up reply actions
Yeah, firing JOB isn't the magic tonic
I dont always agree with coaches rotations, or who he chooses to start, but firing him isn’t gonna save the season. No coach alive could come in, make a few adjustments, and transform us to a 50 win powerhouse kinda team. We may not look like that kinda team till we get the capspace to bring in top level talent…or move a couple of our big expiring contracts next season. Alot of teams will trade for that kinda cap space falling off their books. We’ll have two 11 million contracts next year that are due to fall off. This is definatley a transition period for the blue and gold. Us diehard fans may have to suffer a bit longer and just try to find the bright spots.
by Rush Rules!!! on Dec 5, 2009 5:03 PM EST up reply actions
A Totally Different Take For Me
Once a player gets on opposing teams’ radars, a process begins. The other
teams strive to make the player uncomfortable and to take away his favorite
moves. The player must then either develop counter-moves (adjustments to
the adjustments) or demonstrate that the stuff the other teams are doing will
be ineffective. I believe that it is this process, more than anything else, that
is going on the last few games.
Keep in mind that the opposing teams don’t have much reason to fear our
three-point shooting right now. As a result, among other things, they are
packing the defense in around Roy pretty well—and making it very
difficult for him to receive the ball closer in that about 13 feet from the
basket. That’s just one small example of opposing efforts to make Roy
and the rest of the Pacers uncomfortable.
In other words, I don’t believe Roy’s performance can or should be evaluated
in a vacuum. Opposing teams, and the current struggles of Roy’s teammates
must at least be taken into account. So, two things need to happen: Roy
needs to develop responses to how teams are now playing him, and Roy’s
teammates need to show a whole lot better passing ability than they have
been displaying lately (hitting more outside shots would help as well by
freeing up a little more space for Roy.
Re: Roy's Adjustment to Opposing Teams
It is ultimately JOB’s j-o-b to COACH Roy and to give our sole low post threat opportunity to develop AND HE IS NOT DOING THAT, so I repeat FIRE JOB!!!
by FortWayneKarl on Dec 5, 2009 6:44 PM EST via mobile reply actions
It's JOB's job
to coach the entire team, not just Hibby. If Hibbert isn’t playing well, he will not play. Fanaticus makes some good points, Roy’s struggles have as much to do with the rest of the team struggling as they do with anything else. I would even go as far to say some of Rush’s problems are due to the stagnate offense the Pacers have been running. I think the main thing this team is struggling with is a PG who can calm this offense down and jump start it at the same time. There is very little leadership coming from the PG position. Watson has been doing a good job coming in, hitting some shots, and driving to the basket. Is he a traditional leader on the court? I would say probably not. Until the Pacers have a true court general who can get the ball to people in the right places, at the right times, we are going to be watching some frustrating basketball in stretches. This is one of those stretches…
And I Agree with jantz101
Point guard is a bit of a conundrum for the Pacers right now. I don’t think TJ
is an ideal fit for JOB’S system. But my feelings about TJ are complex. I
thought his defense on Deron Williams last night was excellent. He’s certainly
putting in the effort on that side of the floor. He’s been in an offensive funk but
shows signs of snapping out of it.
But even if he does, is he a “PG who can calm this offense down and jump
start it at the same time”? I don’t think so. Watson fits in better with what
JOB is trying to do, but he’s not nearly so skilled as TJ is. The Pacers are
sort of “making do” with the point guards we have. I wish Price were seen
to be more ready.
As for O’ Brien, I think he is an average to slightly better than average NBA
coach (and that’s a compliment). I don’t think Bird/Morway/Simon are
blaming JOB right now. They are expecting more from the players.
Is JOB’s message getting old to the players? I don’t know. Maybe his tenure
is starting to run its course. It’s hard for us outsiders to really know what’s
going on in the locker room.
Am I a big fan of JOB’s general system? Not particularly, but it’s one way to
approach the task of trying to succeed in this league.
But the main point is that this isn’t college or high school. An NBA coach has
a different role than do his counterparts at lower levels. The players have to
play well. That’s the bottom line, and a coaching change usually doesn’t
accomplish much over the long term (unless you had a really bad coach
to begin with, and I don’t believe that’s the case here). Three or so years
ago when Phil Jackson had a mediocre Laker team, the team had a mediocre
record. Enough said.
The Pacers will have periods when they struggle, but they aren’t THIS bad.
Things will get better soon. But the team is still lacking certain pieces (like
our point guard for the future), so there is a limit to the ceiling.
JOB's message getting old
That’s my biggest concern. I agree that he is a slightly above average coach – not championship level, but certainly a guy who can get his team into the lower half of the playoffs consistently. But it’s starting to feel like the players are tuning him out. Today’s IndyStar articles have quotes from him about how the players aren’t moving around enough on offense and I’ve heard him say this a few times lately. To be honest, I don’t get to watch many games (never on TV here in Boston) but I read a lot about them and the players’ quotes are discouraging.
As for Hibbert, I can’t speculate much since I’ve only watched about 3 games and highlights this year. My guess is that we have a system on offense that will never go through a low post player like Hibbert. Our O is predicated on movement and passing and my sense is that Hibbert is most effective when he gets consistent opportunities in the post to do his thing. He has nice moves but they are slower and deliberate, which don’t fit OB’s system as much. Moreover, like people above have said, our perimeter offense isn’t scaring anyone away from doubling or cheating towards Roy.
Lastly, can we just rest Granger for a couple weeks until he’s healthy. His play and his shot just haven’t been right all season and it looks like he needs to get healthy. No point in wasting this season being half-injured all year. Maybe last night’s re-aggravation will force the issue.
"If you don't [draft me], I promise you I'll come back and kick your ass for the next 15 years."
If they keep playing like this...
If they keep playing like this for another 10-20 games the only way to boost the sagging attendance, not ruin the young players, and put a charge back in the team will be to FIRE JOB!!!!
by FortWayneKarl on Dec 6, 2009 2:14 AM EST via mobile reply actions
difficult situation
i agree with a lot of what fanaticus said. i think teams are more aware of his presence and are being more aggressive in keeping him away from the basket. his post moves are effective only when he is really close to the hoop. if he could just develop a little jumper he would really have a complete offensive game and he wouldn’t be so predictable. he has a nice stroke from the foul line, i would think getting a mid-range game would be easy for him…
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